Bryan Sutton - From Roots to Branches

My guest on this episode is Bryan Sutton.

We're talking about Bryan's new project From Roots to Branches, the follow up to his 2006 album Not Too Far From the Tree, which celebrates its 20th anniversary this year.

The new album features a series of duets with musicians from the wold of bluegrass and beyond, plus a couple of unreleased tunes he recorded with Doc Watson and Tony Rice.

We chat about the original idea behind Not Too Far.... and how the new project differs; who Bryan chose to record with this time (including Billy Strings, Chris Eldridge, Sierra Hull, Trey Hensley, Joe Bonamassa and more); why he's choosing to release it as a series of tracks over several months, before putting the full album out, and how it feels to have gone from recording with his heroes to taking on the mentor role for the next generation of flatpickers.

You'll find all the tracks released so far on Spotify, Tidal and all other streaming platforms. 

There's a great video for The Devil Went Down to Deep Gap  on YouTube.

You can get bluegrass guitar lessons from Bryan Sutton on ArtistWorks (I can highly recommend them).

Oh, and Bryan wrote and recorded the cool theme tune you'll hear on this episode too!

Transcript

Bryan Sutton 0:27

The real energy was again being able to release this new stuff from Doc and Tony, but having again kind of the lineage concept where, you know, instead of people that were essentially my heroes, you know, more peers and pals, if you will, on a new batch of duets, the challenge has always been kind of where I'd stop. You know, if you looked at my ultimate list, you know, I could I could make versions of this record every year for the next decade and still not be done with people that I'd love to just sit and record a song with.

Matt 0:57

Hi, this is Matt, and listen to Bluegrass Jamalong the podcast for anyone and everyone who loves Bluegrass. Hey everybody, welcome back to Bluegrass Jam Along. This week my guest is Brian Stutton, who has been on the podcast a few times, um, a good friend of this show. Um he's on to talk about a new project. Now, 20 years ago, Bryant released a wonderful record called Not Too Far From the Tree, which is a bunch of duets with some of his kind of favourite pickers, mentors, friends, people like Norman Blake, Joey Douglas, Russ Barenberg, Tony Rice, Ricky Skaggs, Doc Watson. Um wonderful, wonderful record, and Whiskey Before Breakfast from that record won a Grammy with Doc. Um and I've chatted to Brian a little bit about that before, but this new project not only celebrates the 20th anniversary of that, but it builds on it as well. It's called From Roots to Branches, and um it's a bunch of new duets with people like Trey Hensley, Billy Strings, Chris Eldridge, like a new generation of pickers. But there's also a couple of unreleased tracks from the original record. Um, one with Doc Watson, one with Tony Rice, they're really cool as well. And then there's uh a kind of thread of bringing people in from beyond the bluegrass flat picking genre, people like Joe Barnamassa and Tommy Emmanuel are in there. Um really cool. Uh wonderful duet with Sierra Hull playing guitar on there as well. It's a really great project. Um, several of the tracks have come out now on the streaming services, lots of them are out there to listen to now, and there's still a few more to come. And the whole thing has been bundled up and put out as a kind of album in August. Um and it was just great fun to get to chat to Brian about this. He is uh just an astonishing musician and real sort of thinker about all of this stuff and and the why of of all of it, and you know, what matters to him as a musician and what's important at this point, and all of that stuff is just really interesting. Um fascinating to chat about him as a player now compared to 20 years ago when he was, you know, maybe the younger guy compared to the people he was playing with, and now maybe he's more in that mental sort of figure and just a really fascinating conversation. Um I'm gonna stick some links in the show notes where you can go and hear the stuff that's out already. But also do listen to the full project when it is out in August. Um yeah, really cool. I'll also stick a link in the show notes to a couple of the other chats that I've had with Brian in case you missed any of those, because they have been fascinating too. Um, all the stuff, as usual, is on the website bluegrassjamalong.com. If you want to go and find all the other interviews, there are dozens and dozens and dozens of them, and some of them are just fascinating things. Um also there's a whole bunch of backing tracks if you want to jam along, learn your fiddle tunes. Um they're all listed on there as well. And yeah, a bunch of cool charts for those. Uh, but that is it. I am gonna leave you alone and let you listen to my conversation with Brian Sutton about his wonderful record from Roots to Branches. Brian Sutton, welcome back to Bully Grass Jamalong. It's a joy to see you as always. Yeah, Matt, it's been a while and uh nice to see you and hear you. And this is a fun one. Um, not only are we talking about a great new record you've got coming out, we're also talking about a great record you've had out for a while now, and I think not too far from the tree is a favourite record of a lot of people. And it turns it's just turned 20. And the new record from Rich to Branches is very much kind of an extension of that and a build on that and kind of a reflection on where you've come since that. So I'm really looking forward to it.

Bryan Sutton 4:45

Well, thank you. And yeah, the whole the the the idea, probably from a few years after the first one was made, um, you know, sort of been in my head for a long time. Like another, you know, that record represented heroes of mine, less about peers and things like that. And more, I mean, obviously Doc Watson and Tony Rice and Earl Scruggs and George Shuffler, Norman Blake. Um, so just an opportunity to record anything with those guys. Uh, but sort of pay tribute to, you know, just honor those heroes of mine, and certainly all of us, but uh but that was the you know the basic concept is to turn around and and look at more again peers, and then the longer I waited, the older I got, and more more younger players came on the scene, so um you know there was plenty to plenty to choose from.

Matt 5:39

Yeah, and that first record um kind of very much about like just you in a room with those people and and it recorded a little bit all over the place by the sound of it. You put your stuff in the car, went to where people were, some people came to you, or just you know, an album recorded on the road.

Bryan Sutton 5:58

Yeah, that was part of the concept of the first one was to put together a little mobile rig of a couple of microphones and a and a a recording device and uh and travel. And so yeah, I went to North Carolina and into George Shuffler's living room and down to Norman Blake's house at Rising Fawn and and uh you know was able to it was not necessarily Doc Watson's house, but a hotel room in Colorado where he and I both happened to be and it and it worked out. But uh there was you know at the point I was at the or that that time I was thinking that was it felt right to sort of, even with all this mobility, to have the same rig, the same mics, the same preamps and things like that. I don't know that that that really matters, but it felt it felt important to me at the time.

Matt 6:46

It's funny, isn't it? Somehow those things do matter. You don't need anybody else to know that that's the case, but it's just nice to connections are always always a nice thing. Um and this record, much more recorded at home by the sound of it.

Bryan Sutton 7:02

Yeah, it was maybe a uh I mean same gear, but but more people came to me uh in this one. Um I think I did a little bit of traveling around Nashville, depending on whose uh schedules of different people, but yeah, I've got a uh setup at the house uh or well where I used to live, and um some good mics and good good gear, and it was that felt right too to kind of have a uh the same space involved and at least the majority of it.

Matt 7:30

Yeah, and it feels like there's a lovely extension of that. I would just let you talk about that original set of tunes, and a lot of those people were your heroes and your mentors and and your friends. Um but this not not only the extension of kind of moving into some of the younger pickers, but also bringing people in from a bit further out from the tree, if we want to go with a metaphor. Um you know, reaching out to other genres and some of the other people that you've been inspired by.

Bryan Sutton 7:55

Yeah, well, um that was again thinking about what I what I could record and who I could record with uh on the on this particular project. You know, a lot has changed in my career in the last 20 years. Uh, and you know, being in Nashville for that period of time and doing a lot more work with a lot more of those kind of folks, Nashville music row folks, and and then just sort of being around the the music world outside of Bluegrass and just creating friendships with people like Tommy Emmanuel or you know, being able to be around guys like Joe Bonamasa. Uh and it just felt like it was a little more of an extension of where I am as a player, you know, less of kind of a newer bluegrasser to the scene and paying tribute to Doc Watson and Tony, and and more of a guy that's been around a while and and uh you know just for me at least seeing a certain value in getting outside of that sort of, I want to say predictable, but more of the what I could have done of just sort of continue to play fiddle tunes with with great players, which would have been really just just fine. But but also the fact that I've been singing a lot more in the last few years, and I still don't really consider myself like a vocalist necessarily, but it's something else that I feel like I can do, and it also provided a lot of great opportunity for other types of songs on this record beyond again just flat-picking fiddle tunes, which that was of interest to me to be able to sing with people and and have great singers like Molly Tuttle, you know, be able to uh uh to do what they do.

Matt 9:29

Yeah, and there's the people on this record, so there's Molly, but also you know, Billy Strings, Trey Hensley, that are every bit as good a singer as they are a picker. And yeah, I wouldn't say it gets forgotten about sometimes, but it's a great thing to be able to celebrate.

Bryan Sutton 9:43

Well, I think um that in the wake of Tony Rice, there was a lot of players like me that sort of came up came along and and were very much guitar students, and I'd always sung my whole life, but uh just never put a lot of energy into it until um you know the last ten years or so. But yes, people like that, like Trey Hensley that just have come out of the gate, um and Billy and Molly, and think of others that are just you know more of that player-singer kind of dual threat. It does, yeah, it's it's more of more of a common thing these days.

Matt 10:24

Yeah, and it is, and I guess it is one of those things that maybe people don't think about singing in the same way, like you pick up an instrument, you have to learn where everything is, whereas singing is something you can naturally do, and it's it sometimes takes some impetus to I remember reading an interview with Chris Thhiely only three or four years ago, and him saying that he'd never really thought that much about his vocals, you know, because he'd spent so much time thinking about the instrument.

Bryan Sutton 10:51

Yeah, I mean here's another one that I was just thinking about him that you know, as far as musicians that I was around 20 years ago, like Chris, and he obviously he was singing with Nickel Creek back then, and but yeah, it was like that was sort of a secondary thing. Um and I think because of Chris uh as such a influential figure in acoustic music, who certainly over those you know last couple of decades of has made as much of a sort of an impact on the music because of his writing and singing and and and playing as well, you know, and that just that trickles through, you know, uh inevitably to where you know a lot of the younger players that I continue to kind of see and work with, you know, a lot of them are singing these days. It's just it's sort of so yeah, more maybe more normalized again, which is good. I think you know fifty years ago it was way more normal, you know, for guitar players to sing, especially in bluegrass where it's from the Lester flat sort of archetype, you know, where that that was the lead singer in the bluegrass band was the was the guitar player.

Matt 11:53

Well, and just looking back at this list of kind of people on the first record, and you think about Tony and Norman, um, but also like somebody like Earl did a lot of singing in his time, Ricky Skagg's great singer, you know, there's there's a grand tradition of that. Um and it's it makes for a really interesting listen having some some vocals in there because there's also a lot of fun had with those vocals. There's a couple of the tracks on there that are kind of some of the kind of most lighthearted moments on this record. And but but all of it is it's pretty I mean, just it feels like it's a very conversational record, which is only natural, but it's but it's one of the things that you notice most. Yeah.

Bryan Sutton 12:34

Well thank yeah, I guess for me uh you that you hit it there, just realizing what I'm trying to accomplish with this record is is less about kind of two guitar players going at each other and more about two friends just sharing a song and vocal tunes, not that instrumental tunes can't do that, and certainly with people like you know Jake Stargell and Jake Wortman, you know, there's plenty plenty of opportunity for that, but just because of Trey Hensley and his voice, and uh you know why not? And and and it's just it feels more natural, especially for that kind of relationship, for uh for us to do you know a song with lyrics and and and sing, and and so you know, I I just think that's also again part of the it feels most right for me to have songs like that on this record. And even so, I it's just I'm still a guitar player first, but that's part of my own evolution too, again, as a singer and writing songs more that you know I I want to hear more singing and more just songs. I would get bored with a record of just fiddle tunes.

Matt 14:47

And I think one of the things I find fascinating by this record, because I know it's been on your mind for quite a while to make this record, and I'm curious as to whether kind of how you first envisioned it compared to how it ended up was any different. Like when you first started thinking about this as a project, like what was knocking around in your head at that point.

Bryan Sutton 15:09

Well, one of the uh the main things that that that happened that were it was sort of wouldn't leave my head was I don't remember the year maybe within eight to ten years after the release of the first record, going back through these digital tapes that I'd used to capture the first stuff and transferring that to fully digital hard drive Pro Tools, you know, uh you know, living in a hard drive space, and just listening to just sort of the raw data that was captured and discovering all this stuff and and talking about complete songs with Doc and Tony that I'd totally forgotten about. Had no and no remembrance. I mean, I remember being in the in the room with them and and and it we didn't just do one or two songs, but you know, it was just kind of a casual sit down and just play through some tunes, and and I knew back then there was a a goal to get like with Doc, it was whiskey before breakfast, and we got multiple takes of that. But yeah, just so in this literally sitting in my home studio just discovering this stuff that had been I don't want to say lost, but just totally forgotten about. So I felt like okay, there's there's an opportunity to either kind of do a follow-up or sort of an EP part two of not too far from the tree with this it was mainly it came down to Doc and Tony as far as new material that I could use, but also again, how could that connect with a totally new batch? So it you know, for me it was uh the real energy was again being able to release this new stuff from Doc and Tony, um, but having again kind of the lineage concept where you know instead of people that were essentially my heroes, now more peers and pals, if you will, um, on a new batch of duets, the challenge has always been kind of where I stop. You know, if you looked at my ultimate list, you know, I could I could make versions of this record every year for the next decade and still not be done with people that I'd love to just sit and record a song with. Um so that will continue to be the challenge. It was and for a while it kind of kept me from doing it because I didn't want to either, you know, not necessarily make anybody mad, but just didn't make anybody feel left out. Uh, and because it just seemed like such a challenge to figure out, you know, because I do have to stop somewhere. Um uh at least for you know, within what's called maybe this first batch, maybe there's a part three that'll follow follow up. Uh, that would be really easy to do. We'll just have to see how the uh how it works. But anyway, the point is is like that was how it kind of wrestled around in my mind for a lot of years of just yeah, I could do this and I would use these people, but then what about this person? And I don't know about this, and and eventually I just had to get over that. And part of it for me too was you know finally getting a home studio that I felt like was suitable for this. I've always had kind of a space at home that I've called a studio, but had some remodeling done and and felt like I had a nice, nice spot that somebody could come over and we could sit and and uh and do this. So I just it just kind of built from that sort of energy. Um so yeah, combinations of the Doc and the Tony and just just kind of getting over myself a little bit as far as what I wanted to do that was new and who I wanted to do it with and just just go. And uh you know, I live here in Nashville, so uh it was easy to kind of get off the ground with people that were in town. I started this kind of right around the the Christmas break, um I guess 2023 maybe. Uh and uh and just you know started making calls and sending emails and and just just having you know getting people while they're in town and and uh just kind of doing a little bit at a time and just sort of built from there.

Matt 19:14

And it is lovely having that kind of connection of having some more doc and some more Tony, and also you know, just since that first record, we don't have Doc and we don't have Tony, so any opportunity to have a little bit more of either of them that is new is a is a beautiful thing, but it's it's a lovely connection between the two records as well.

Bryan Sutton 19:34

Yeah. Thank well, and not to keep harping on the vocal aspect of this, but the fact that one of the uh the tunes from Doc was Working Man Blues that I had no idea he was going to sing, and I felt lucky that I had a mic placed close enough to his voice to to be able to hear it. But just the fact that he did that kind of opened up the door of like, oh yeah, I should I should do more vocal tunes, and it and it came from that discovery of uh you know Doc playing that uh that was the last thing we sat in a room and and uh and he just launched into it and I had no idea it was coming, but um I'm glad he did.

Matt 20:16

And there's a lovely um kind of synchronicity between that and then hearing you and Trey sing it takes all kinds to make a world because you've got kind of particularly on Whiskey Before Breakfast, um uh but also on the new record of Working Man Blues, kind of Doc like talking to you, telling you when to take a break, kind of comment in the way that Doc Doc does, just kind of chipping in and you know. Um, and there's that there's that same element between you and Trey on on the track on this record, and it's lovely to hear it kind of like moving across. It's almost like a uh an audio representation of your shift from being the mentee to more of the mental figure in some ways, and it's a lovely little moment when I first did that track.

Bryan Sutton 20:58

Oh well, thank you. Well, I mean, that's part of the Doc Watson lesson beyond just here's how he would interpret a fiddle tune. It's just he never quite had you know, or the things weren't so precious to where it was like, okay, we've got to be quiet and and record this song or perform this song. And it was just you know, it was just always in the moment. And oh, by the way, why don't you play this and let's play it again? Let's all play it. You know, it was that was was something I've always taken from Doc is it's this wonderful blend of like caring and preparing, but also just letting a moment be a moment and making the most of whoever's there, doing whatever they're doing. And uh yeah, again, I think in a duet format, that's uh again what I'm trying to accomplish with these things, is just capture a I've called it sort of a musical conversation where I would hope that somebody listening hears more of a relationship between two people than they do just here's a bunch of notes on an instrument or words being sung.

Matt 21:55

Yeah, and you definitely do. It's the there's something beautifully informal about it, and it's like it's something that as a fan of bluegrass music, like from some of the tapes that are out there and some of the things you see on social media and some of the bits on YouTube, it's really obvious that some amazing music happens when people pickers just get together. Like it's not necessarily in a studio and it's not necessarily planned, and you get to occasionally listen in, and this feels like that. Like I'm you, you know, I'm sort of sat in the corner of your living room while friends pass through and pick a tune with you.

Bryan Sutton 22:28

Yeah, it's and it's it's definitely that. It's definitely um, I mean, I would get multiple takes of some of these songs and and do a little bit of editing here and there, but but I like keeping these things as live as possible, and as you know, there's still uh like I did a tune with uh Zeb Snyder and uh Sally Ann, and you know, we sat down and said, What do you want to play? I don't know, what do you want to play? And it's it's as casual as that. Um there would be other situations where I might think about, okay, this kind of song with this kind of person, and um but you know, never really an arrangement, never anything until we sat there and it's you know, just sort of feel what the guitar sounded like together. And um yeah, that's uh I don't know how how intent I was. I wanna I I knew that that I didn't want it to be too too thought about. I wanted to I wanted things to feel casual and comfortable. And so yeah, that sweet spot of you know, once we're there, you know, I can think like a record producer and okay, this is what is gonna make a good shape and and sound like an arrangement, but uh but So that's worked out in real time.

Matt 23:36

And it must be tricky to get your maybe it's not, but I mean my perception is that it's tricky, but if you're the one responsible for setting up the mics and getting the tone and the balance and kind of have your producers head on, and then to just also as soon as you start playing, to forget all that and just be there. You know. Yeah.

Bryan Sutton 23:53

It is challenging. I I've listened to uh some other interviews with like actors who have become directors who also act and direct at the same time. And I've done enough of that in Nashville too, where I've been producing or leading something or you know, been part of the team, but also playing. And so I've got a enough experience to kind of understand what that feels like. So it wasn't anything completely new, but it is it is kind of weird. And I and I knew going back to you know also being an engineer uh or wearing that hat. I don't call myself an engineer, but enough of an engineer hat, going back and and listening to some of the things like, oh gosh, I should have noticed that this person moved you know six inches off the mic during this take. Um, you know, uh a dedicated engineer would have noticed this kind of stuff, but you know, there's usually a workaround. Um but yeah, it's and maybe that adds to the sort of homegrown, organic, listenable, comfortable quality of it. The fact that it's just not so perfect. I don't know that a ca a casual listener would would notice the stuff that I might notice. Uh, but but still, uh again, just in the imperfection of it, um, I find that that's where to me like the more listenable stuff is. I guess I had that experience you know years and years ago making a record where the first thing I did, I was just so hyper-focused and micromanaged everything, and I just can't listen to that stuff these days. But when I got over myself and and started trying to experiment more with just capturing things and going for more live performances, if I listen back to that stuff, it feels more listenable to me. Um, and so I'm trying still trying to sort of just believe that that idea of just, you know, like you'll I'm never going to make anything perfect, and and the effort of perfection is just futile anyway. So there's there's something to be said about just going with what is there. Again, again, that doc cut of working man blues, it's like there was no planning, there was no, I mean the mics were in the right place, there were they were there, but they weren't in the right place, but it still works. I mean, a good performance, the right person doing the right thing, um, that still translates through all the all the stuff, all the stuff that could go wrong. And again, somebody on the inside might know it, but most people are just there to hear the and feel the emotion and hear the hear the hear the performance.

Matt 26:07

And that's the thing, isn't it? If you've got if the energy is there, you can forgive pretty much anything else, you know, if you if you're feeling that.

Bryan Sutton 26:13

Yeah, that's the lesson. And it's it's hard as a you know, when you're producing engineering playing, you know, that there is a tendency to to micromanage, and but you just have to let that go.

Matt 26:24

One of my kind of favourite examples of that kind of balance is listen to Bruce Springsteen's Tiger Sessions record. And like you've seen the videos of how it was recorded, the horns are set up somewhere down the hall, everybody else is in the living room and he's just shouting out he wants to take a break. Like, we're gonna move to B now, and he's just telling them what to play and what and it but it's just the most joyous thing, and it could be could be awful, but it's not because they're all they're all committed, they're all there, and when Bruce says off we go to another key off, they all go.

Bryan Sutton 26:52

Yeah, well, I mean it's it's all folk music at the end of the day. If it's not, you know, sort of prepared symphonic classical music, you can go pay to see that, you know, extremely rehearsed stuff. Uh but that's what we love about folk music is that it's so human, and uh you know, there there has been a lot of sort of uh infiltration or kind of monkeying with that idea. But when it's when it's raw and real, it's kind of undeniable. And I I I love that. You know, I work on a lot of you know very uh sort of planned and gridded and produced music, and so it's you know, I always loved having a balance in my life of music that was far from that. So so I get I guess again that's what I tried in the stuff that I actually make, try not to be so so precious about our every little thing. While also being precious about every little thing.

Matt 27:42

Well, this is I mean, this is entirely the job of being a human being, isn't it? Is the knowing when to let go and how to let go. Yeah. Um and I was delighted when and we'll talk about this maybe in a in a bit about how these songs have come out and how the sort of the album has made its way out into the world. But I was delighted as these tracks came out to see a track with Sierra Hull, and I was doubly delighted to hear her play guitar in it because Sierra is an extraordinary singer, an extraordinary songwriter, an extraordinary mandolinpe, but she's also one of my favourite guitar players, and I don't get to hear her play enough guitar.

Bryan Sutton 28:15

That was one of the first mo times that I kind of paid attention to her when she was a kid, or her dad or somebody posted a YouTube video of her just kind of playing guitar, jamming it on something in their house, and just so so mature sounding and strong, and uh yeah, like just anytime we've been together I I yeah, same way. I love to hear her play the guitar. Um, I love the stuff that she plays on her current uh current stuff or original music.

Matt 28:47

And I love the fact that it's grandfather's clock, it's one of those kind of slightly old-fashioned tunes. A bit, a bit maybe a bit like um old spinning wheel or something that you did on the first record with David Greer. It's just it's a really simple tune that's easy to pass over, I think, but sometimes those have the most opportunity for a little bit of quiet beauty in them.

Bryan Sutton 29:10

Well, I'm I'm always going to be a fan, especially for this kind of record, you know, uh strong melodies, and again, I'm a fan of the more simple sounding melodies. Uh Spinning Wheel's a great example. Yeah, I've always loved Grandfather's Clock. Umes that are played oftentimes as instrumentals but sort of come from the vocal world originally. And uh but yeah, just the fact that it's just a strong melody, that's um that's that was the uh the big connection for me. It's easy to lose the melody in a lot of fiddle tunes, a lot of noty fiddle tunes. But when it's singable like that, you know, even a fiddle tune can be singable, but some of them can get kind of noty. Uh, but just when it right out of the gate, it's such a recognizable, strong, noticeable melody. Um that's that's that's what I'm going for.

Matt 30:00

And I loved reading that you played your grandfather's guitar on that.

Bryan Sutton 30:05

Yeah. 1942 single O seventeen, Martin, and uh and Sierra played another 1935 single O eighteen that I own. So they're you know, I kind of leave them beside each other in my closet, so they uh they know each other well. They spend a lot of time together, so it was it was nice to use those instruments. And that was the other thing, like on this project to try to use other guitars, not just everybody playing dreadnoughts. So, like the one I did with Tommy, we're both playing triple O eighteens, um, and we get you know deep into the guitar nerd world here, but um you know I I take that in consideration too, as far as the voices and and what the song is and what guitars are going to support uh that tune. You know, I did a song with Andrew Marlin and you know, real Norman Blake inspired, and so I used I have a pre-war Norman Blake model and slot head mahogany uh dreadnought, and just you know, again, deep into the guitar nerd, but but uh but I love that stuff. It it to me it all all is part of the the soup, all those little factors.

Matt 31:15

Yeah, I'm and I don't know if I've remembered this wrong, but I my memory is that you played the same guitar and all the tracks on not too far from the tree.

Bryan Sutton 31:24

Yeah, again, that was part of the the the style there was the same gear, the same mics. I played the same guitar. Again, my thinking was so you know, if you listen to this whole thing, you're gonna hear lots of different personalities, and each other each of the duet partners would be playing whatever instrument they're playing, but I would, you know, I would always have the same instrument. And on this one, again, just sort of didn't feel so uh or as inclined to maintain that. I mean my D28 is probably featured more on this new batch than anything, but but still I wanted to play other things just because again, that's part of been part of my evolution. Is I enjoy playing lots of other guitars and just having other other sounds. Again, the the tune with Trey, you know, for whatever reason, it just felt right to use resonators. Just a little more honk, a little more country twang. You know, he and I find a lot of common ground in that world too, beyond bluegrass. And then you've got Devil Went Down to Deep Gap, which you know completely blows everything out of the water, uh, template-wise.

Matt 32:25

Well, I was about to ask you about that track because um that's that sort of takes it to whole other levels. Um there's so many things to love about it, and and it it made me smile because like I've known for a while that you are a big fan of kind of rock, you know, big Eddie Van Halen fan. Billy is obviously if I know Che Hensley, when I interviewed him, said when he first met Billy they sort of joked about forming a Black Sabbath tribute band, and the the thread of kind of hard rock and metal that runs through the bluegrass flat picking community is pretty strong, isn't it?

Bryan Sutton 32:58

It is. Uh I feel that there's a real similar energy and and kind of a sink your teeth into it, you know, as far as the concept of like drive and acoustic music, bluegrass, and even, you know, like the the sort of Django Reinhardt gypsy swing, just a real sort of uh I don't want to say muscle, but just a visceral kind of dig in. Um and you know, that's what I feel when I listen to Iron Maiden and Black Sabbath and and Metallica. And uh and yeah, Billy and I, same kind of thing. We've we've just we're always talking about that stuff. Have you heard this new band, you know, or Sarah, I'll send him new songs and him, you know, him, me, and um you know, part of like him and part of the as part of this record, this this at least this current collection, knowing that he and I have a whole record of duet acoustic playing. It wasn't out at the time that we made that song, but just knowing that that was going to be out, you know, a whole whatever two hours collection of he and I playing acoustic guitars. I didn't want something that was just kind of uh, you know, an extension of that. Um and wanting to do something that would offer an opportunity to play electric guitar. Is there some way that on a essentially a duet's acoustic guitar record, can he can he and I play acoustic and electric and what would make that happen? And and um so that's where my brain went to the devil went down to Georgia as here's here's a piece of music that kind of straddles some different styles within itself, and maybe that maybe there's something possible there. And so um anyway, it kind of kind of went from there and I built a little demo at home and gave it to him, and he's like, Okay, sure. Why not why not?

Matt 34:58

And it's you know, and there's double kick drum drums on there. There's you know, you got the whole you you take that idea to its fullest conclusion, don't you?

Bryan Sutton 35:08

Well, there's there's no reason to hold back. And uh and maybe it's I mean, I do want people to laugh at it and and you know take it seriously, but not too seriously. And I mean, I've listened to uh was it Andy Sandberg, great Saturday Night Live actor, writer, and actor in general, but did a lot of like comedy music. And I remember him in an interview, and also think about Red Knuckles and the Trailblazers too. Where it's like part of what makes it impactful and not just funny, but just interesting as kind of a uh uh parody, if you will, or whatever. It's just the fact that you know you really do it, you do it well, you really commit to it, and and don't hold back, don't don't think of this as just like, well, let's just be some bluegrassers that want to dip their toe into the rock and roll, rock and roll world. No, let's let's let's put three tracks of bass on it and yeah, double kick drum, and and I'll get the heaviest guitar rig I can find. And and let's just go as as much as we can into it and really commit. And I that's why I like the animation idea too. Like it like it just doesn't hold back. And um again, I'm not saying it's the it's gonna change the world or anything, but just what I like seeing come out of it, it was just uh it felt committed. And when I played it for like legit, you know, heavy metal uh aficionados uh that I work with, they're like, oh yeah, those drums those drum sounds are right. And the guy that mixed it too is a guy, a friend of mine named Jeff Balding here at Nashville who's worked on like megadeth records, but I also record acoustic country music with him as well, and so I knew he was kind of perfect for it to be able to get both sides of that song sounding as as legitimate and as clear and strong as possible.

Matt 36:51

Yeah, and it well it's funny because you mentioned Iron Maiden earlier, and that's exactly what I get from Iron Maiden is that like they take their craft extremely seriously, and the detail and the precision and just the sheer kind of intricacy of their rhythm section is extraordinary. But you see them live, and Bruce Dickinson's coming out in some silly costumes, and they've got a 20-foot-high mummy waddling along behind them on the stage, and they also don't take it seriously at all. There's something extraordinary theatrical about it at the same time, and it's a lovely mix of stuff to see.

Bryan Sutton 37:21

Yeah, I love that. I mean, just the the turt the theatre of it all is part of what I think whether they people admit it or not, you know, that that are in that heavy metal world, and it is sort of over the top, and uh you know, that that's part of it to me. That's what I love about it, along with the shredding and and yeah, the grooves and the and the riffs and the drum sounds and the just the heaviness of it. Um it's just it's just fun to kind of watch.

Matt 37:52

And then obviously the other bit of electric guitar on the record is Joe Bonamasa. Oh, yeah. That's a really interesting bit of texture after hearing a lot of acoustic guitars.

Bryan Sutton 38:00

Well, that was another situation where there was not a lot of conversation before we got to the studio, and maybe a little assuming on my part just because again, I've not spent a ton of time with him, but but um you know I wasn't really sure what he would play walking into the studio, and uh and but you know I think it's it's kind of perfect, and and it's presents what he felt or knows is the is you know the strongest version of him in that situation. Uh and I and I think it really works. And I play with a lot of electric players in Nashville, you know, all the time, and and I like that sound of electric and acoustic working together. I I'm a fan of all the work that Albert Lee did with Emmy Lou Harris uh back in the hot band days, you know, where they're uh it's not necessarily him with the bluegrass band, but there would be elements like that. Um and just the fact that it's just just just textures. And I did, you know, that was that was part of the the thinking going into it. That was one where I knew like blue night would be a good one just because it's a bluegrass tune, but it's also, you know, it doesn't follow a traditional blues uh 12-bar scheme, but it's it's enough of something that's you know can define itself as a bluegrass tune and a blues song. Uh I just you know, I just think it works. Um I was really happy that he that he chose to do that again. I didn't know we didn't really talk about it, but I'm I'm happy with with the way it came out.

Matt 39:35

Well it's interesting because there's a lot of records. Um you think now about Sarah Drose's Blue Heron Suite or Sierra Hull's last record, um, where people are using essentially acoustic bands but with some really interesting textual electric guitars, and it it's just a lovely sound about it because you get this this gorgeous sort of sound world that is the best of both.

Bryan Sutton 40:00

Yeah, well, I think about Mike Seal too, who's uh been out touring with Jerry Douglas the last few years, and uh I love playing with him, um and just another guy that that sort of knows what he I don't say needs to do, but just what he feels is the right call to kind of uh fit in with with acoustic sounds. And I think what the electric brings, kind of like a Dobro, where there's just more sustain, you know, it's just a it's just a different kind of voice. Um you know, acoustic instruments generally are pretty, you know, uh pointed, you know, a little less sustained, a little less um, well, I'm not sure what I'm trying to say with that. Uh just I think, well, I would just sum this up and say that it can work. And I think with players like Joe, we're talking about Mike Seal as well, um, there's an attention to that and an awareness of okay, this is something that doesn't normally happen. It doesn't fall together like a guitar and a mandolin, maybe, um, or two acoustics even. But but there's there's potential there, and that's part of the the the fun of the chemistry, is we're not quite sure how these elements are going to work, but we know it can. And we could sit around and discuss why, but it just does because of the players that sort of know what to do or know what they're listening for. Um, and I think again, that's what one of the brilliant parts of Joe Bonamasa is just I mean, he's Shredder, Shredder, and just a wonderful player, but just such he's a deep musician as well, and again, just kind of a nerd for tone and and amps and pickups and and you know, we just had good comments you know just in the studio because I was able because he's playing the strat, it gave me a lot of space down in the low end to kind of think more like a like a bass player, as much when I were when I'm playing rhythm and singing and kind of be a band for him. And so I I enjoyed sort of fitting into his world as he may have uh felt kind of fitting into mine. So anyway, it was just it was really fun.

Matt 42:08

I'd love to ask you about kind of one of the really interesting aspects of this record is how you've chosen to put it out because we're talking about a record, like there isn't a record yet. There's a collection of tracks that have come. I've heard the ones that are out and a few of the bits that are on the way. Um, but it's very much been put out into the world kind of a song at a time, rather than one big dump of an album. I'm curious as to the kind of reasoning for that, like what sort of led you down that route.

Bryan Sutton 42:34

Well, that's a really good question. Uh, and and a lot of it is kind of an experiment, uh, sort of a non-traditional way to release what is a project, at least for the world of bluegrass. Uh in my country work, Nashville Session Player, I see this kind of thing happen a lot. And it happens in pop music more too, um, with big artists, where you know, there may be a few singles released for months at a time before an actual project is is complete. Um so I know it has been done, but I also know with the folks at Mountain Home, Mickey Campbell and John Weisberger that I'm working with, um it just felt like the right kind of strategy. Um it's tough to release music these days. What is it? They say a hundred and some thousand songs released every day uh in this in this world. And uh, you know, there's there's a certain strategy in in sort of creating a series where you sort of gain some attention and you know, then people maybe look forward to the next one, and then more people look forward to the one after that, and more people look forward to the one after that. And then, oh, by the way, here's some new stuff that's coming out in more of a what's called the record down, you know, a few months later. So there's you know, there's some industry strategy behind that. But I also feel like with this particular batch, and we've talked about a lot of the variety here and the and the sounds and the players, and uh, it's not again just not what you would call a bluegrass record. Um, so there's you know, in the modern day, there's an opportunity to to give the track with Joe Bottomasa a little space, um, you know, for Joe Bottomasa fans to kind of say, what is this thing? And and uh, you know, not just deliver this whole batch where maybe that gets kind of lost in the in the in the mass of of releasing everything. And when that's part of the other side of this is you know, there's a lot of songs here. Um I mean I'm looking at my list now and I can't even uh see the end of it here. Maybe we're looking at around 20 tunes, 20 some songs. And uh so there's you know, there's a lot more. And uh so I I like the idea of kind of at least leading up to the main release that songs have a little bit of a chance to kind of live. And uh and I think too, it's uh it gives you know you and I a chance to talk about stuff like this. And uh part of my goal too was to sort of see this as a logical extension to the first record that came out 20 years ago. Um, and then again those connections with the Doc and Tony tracks as sort of the bridge between the two. So there's you know, there's a little bit of a story to tell here with all this versus just saying, okay, here's a large back of batch of tunes and enjoy it. So it's you know, I appreciate the Mountain Home label and and their willingness to to kind of play ball this way and just see because again, I've had meetings with them, you know, over the turn of last year, and and uh like we don't know. Oh, but let's try it and see what happens and and see what the reaction is. And and uh so so far, so good.

Matt 45:41

Yeah, it's a very interesting point. It does sort of give each of these tracks a chance to kind of reach out a bit. There is you release an album, you share it, all the people on it will share it, and everybody will see it in one big go, but it is a chance for each of these to sort of go out into the world as little postcards in their own right and have their have their little moments separately.

Bryan Sutton 46:02

Yeah, and I think um again with the current sort of streaming world, um, you know, none of this is going away. Uh, and hopefully with the release of the the bigger batch that the earlier songs get a little more attention as well. And so, you know, it's a way to sort of uh like I say, just sort of extend maybe the life of what this thing could be versus just one one main shot.

Matt 46:30

Yeah. And what and when do we see the full kind of the full album, as it were, is that in the summer? Yes.

Bryan Sutton 46:37

The date is August 28th of 2026, with the pre-saves going live July 3rd. And you heard our first folks. Yeah. And that's yeah, that's when uh what is considered the record now is uh uh slated to be yeah fully released.

Matt 46:58

And you mentioned just again there, kind of harking back to the first record, and it's something I've heard you mention in a couple of interviews. I was just really curious to ask about it in this context. I've heard you say before that you felt at times a little bit like you fell between generations as a musician, that the kind of guys on that first record and the Baylors and the Jerry's and the Tonies and the Sambushes were sort of slightly beyond being your peers, but the next kind of batch of you know, Thelis and Chris Eldridge and that that for a part of your career you felt slightly like you fell between two generations. And I wonder, like now, sort of 20 years on from the first record and 20 years further into your journey, how that if that feels different as you're sort of coming more towards the the mental side of things.

Bryan Sutton 47:48

Yeah, I mean, for where I sit, and you know, my sense of still Sam Baylor or if Tony Rice were still around, you know, still seeing this generation of players that I listened to as a kid. I think maybe that's the defining feature is who were you listening to when you were 12 years old, you know, and for me that's what you know it was Tony and Baylor and Jerry Douglas and Sam Bush. And uh and so yeah, to find myself touring and on stage and recording with those guys, and and because I did a lot with those guys, you know, from like 2000, you know, for 20 years or so, that players that were listening to that when they were 12, you know, and heard me um, you know, I don't say uh assuming that I was maybe the same age as those people, but just sort of uh you know, connecting me with that that kind of crowd or that kind of sound or that um that group, which is fine. I mean, I mean that's I will gladly be associated with with that that crew of musicians. Uh but yeah, as far as if I were to go down the path of like trying to figure out kind of where I fit in a lot of this kind of stuff, if we you know, if you want to go there, do feel like again, it's it's ultimately it's about good fortune. Good fortune to come out as a youngster in mid-90s with Ricky Skags and sort of taken under the wing of Tony Rice, Baylor Fleck Jared Douglas Sambush, and um and then influence people that were that were younger than me. And even though those players that I am talking about here that are that were people that I was listening to when I was 12, um, I'm happy to be, you know, one still around, and and especially now as I feel like I'm less maybe sort of performer, guitar, picker, creator guy, and and more of a teacher. Uh I've certainly done way more of that over the last 10 to 15 years than ever thought I would. And I really feel right now too, uh, whether you call a mentor or just again a teacher or whatever, but but but that's where I feel like I am now. And you know, so maybe I'm over the idea of feeling like I need to like stamp my own name into all this, but just enjoy where I am and in the opportunities that I have. And so for that, again, just to keep winding around here, um wherever I fall in any sort of timeline, where I am now, I feel like is the opportunity to just um you know, again, be reflective and and look to a younger generation and and and teach what I know and and do the best that that I can to kind of support the um kind of continuing of this craft and this kind of guitar playing. And um I see that as more of a uh more fun, more more energy than I do even in in kind of performing and playing right now.

Matt 50:55

So well, but and it must be really interesting putting together a project like this to kind of, you know, particularly once you became aware it was going to be 20 years on from not too far from the tree, just it is uh sometimes opportunities to reflect in that way are rare because you're still moving forward and you're doing the next thing, and to have an opportunity to look back at that phase of your career and your life and your development as a musician and a human and all of those things. And since that time, kind of you know, you've like raised kids and become a teacher and become you know a whole new phase of your life, and it must be it can it can only be fascinating to reflect on that and to be grateful for the that bunch of documents of those tunes with those people and those conversations at that time to look back on.

Bryan Sutton 51:43

Yeah, uh well, that's the gratitude part is huge here of just if I do straddle some generations, the the the good fortune of that is that I straddle generations. I'm not I'm not limited to one thing or the other, that I that I get to be friends and still hang with Bayland, Sam, and Jerry, and and then you know, also know Zeb Snyder and Jake Eddy and Sierra Hall and and make music with them. And just again, I think that's fortunate to find myself musically in that sort of environment. And again, with the teaching thing being a big part of what I do these days, too. I mean, that really fulfills me. Um and so yeah, I'm just I'm grateful. I was thinking about this, you know, coming into doing this chat with you today, and just like that's one of the main things I feel is just kind of grateful to still be around, grateful to still be doing it, grateful for an opportunity to to have a new batch of music to put out to the world. But you know, I don't even think about that as much as just I don't know, it just seems like it's well it's it's not I don't I don't look at it as much like for my career I need to put out a new record. It's just it's a different sort of mindset at this point. I'm not really sure how to articulate it other than just it just feels like something I have an opportunity to do, uh, have had an opportunity to capture and record and make, and it just it's an extension of that opportunity to just send it out to the world. Yeah, that's it's it's a weird sort of place where like I'm not touring, I'm not you know, I'm not gonna go support this record with you know 90 90 shows or anything like that, but just um but it is you know it's it's it's just something to share, and the teaching feels that way too. I feel like I have something to share and something to sort of impart or help somebody with, and and uh yeah, that's you I feel gratitude for the opportunity to to see that at the end of the day.

Matt 53:43

And it's a it's a joyous thing for the rest of us to get to share in as well, and I've really enjoyed spending the last hour sharing your thoughts on it. Um it's always a pleasure talking to you, Brian. I've really enjoyed this nickel. You too, Matt.